Neo TeAm Forum

NEO Coding Competitions => NEO Compo 2007 => The past Neo Coding Compos => NEO Spring Coding Compo 2007 => Topic started by: Dr.neo on April 06, 2007, 01:22:53 PM

Title: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on April 06, 2007, 01:22:53 PM
the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/neo_compo_2007/spring/neo-spring-compo-2007-psp-winner.gif)

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/neo_compo_2007/spring/neo-spring-compo-2007-NDS-winner.gif)

sorry for delay a little to announce it, congrats with all winners,very glad to see have many great entry in this comop too!  :P

here is the final result,and we start use a new way to calculate the score of every entry:

[1] NEOTEAM / DCEMU / EMUBOARD / ALL vote have 25% each for the total calculation.
[2] Sort the order for each judger,and give out the score from low to high, for example the NDS game,have 21 entries,so the No.1 get 21 points,and the No.2 get 20 points,and so on.
[3] For the poll of 3 forums,calculate each entry have how many votes totally,then give out the order and converte to score of vote.
[4] Now we have all score form 3 judgers and 3 forum public poll,then we can get the total score for every entry,then,the winner is come out!

if you want to check how we calculate it,you can download this excel  file here: 
http://www.neoflash.com/img/neo_compo_2007/spring/neo spring compo 2007-result.rar




   the NEO 2007 Spring COMPO winner list
   PSP-App-Division
   
1   AFKIM3                                 By: danzel
2   Old School Library (OSLib) Sprites Lib By: phosphorous
3   ThemeFlasher                           By: ai3gtmc
4   PUNANI v1.0                            By: hallo007
5   metronomPSP                            By: saulotmalo
6   COW TIPS                               By: Sektor
7   Sheep Machine                          By: miNi
   
   
   PSP-Game-Division
   
1   Will Hexaxis XXI be ready             By: darksoft
2   GoGo Goo - by BennyRebirth & Dalk     By: bennyrebirth
3   Cspsp v1.2                            By: nataku92
4   Pokemon Keeper                        By: N64Francois
5   Space Escape                          By: Grimfate126
6   Call of Duty 2 - PSP Edition v1.0     By: sg57
7   Bumper Car Mayhem                     By: Fuzzie 360
8   Pro Foosball V0.1                     By: Madcupid
9   Legacy                                By: psp_jono
10   Zlink                               By: rattmuffen
   
   
   
   NDS-App-Division
   
1   *****
2   Phidias                                By: Tassu
3   StyxDS v0.2                            By: redbug
4   IRCDS 0.3d                             By: freemaan
5   DSPad                                  By: ced
5   μLibrary                               By: Brunni
6   DSPhoto 1.0                            By: Arialia
7   Pictoblog                              By: 0xtob
8   MapViewerDS                            By: mollusk
9   Binary Clock                           By: mastertop101
   
   
   
   NDS-Game-Division
   
1   WolveSlayer                           By: Payk
2   Warcraft : Tower Defense              By: Noda
3   08. VIRUS DS                          By: kukulcan
4   War of the Weeds                      By: mollusk
5   Duke3DS                               By: GPF
6   Blubb 3D                              By: qwrty
7   BANJO ADVANCE V2 : Kazooie Rescue     By: omg
7   Touchdown! The Alien Attack           By: Sweater Fish Deluxe
8   Earth Invaders 0                      By: smealum
9   SensitiveDS                           By: spinal
10   NDS SPORTS                          By: Davgav

   
the prize list:

The No.1  : Nintendo Revolution one set(note: 110V Japan version) or NDS Lite console one set or PSP one set (winner can choose) or us$200 cash or any item from the No.2 & No.3 prize list.

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/revolution.jpg)

1   AFKIM3                                 By: danzel
1   Will Hexaxis XXI be ready              By: darksoft
1   *****
1   WolveSlayer                            By: Payk


The No.2 & No.3  : NEO product one set (winner can choose anything,without any limit)

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/mk6/NEO-MK6-cart.JPG)

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/mk5_giga-06.jpg)

2   Old School Library (OSLib) Sprites Lib By: phosphorous
2   GoGo Goo - by BennyRebirth & Dalk      By: bennyrebirth
2   Phidias                                By: Tassu
2   Warcraft : Tower Defense               By: Noda
3   ThemeFlasher                           By: ai3gtmc
3   Cspsp v1.2                             By: nataku92
3   StyxDS v0.2                            By: redbug
3   08. VIRUS DS                           By: kukulcan

they can choose:
MK6-Motion for NDS  [US$49.00]  (this item ship in June.)
NEO MD flash cart lite version  [US$49.00]
MK5 16G GIGA cart  [US$59.00]
MK5 8G GIGA cart  [US$49.00]
NEO3-Mini-SD NDS Cart for NDS & Lite  [US$49.00]
NEO3-TF NDS Cart for nds-lite only [US$49.00]
NEO3-SD NDS Cart for nds & lite [US$49.00]
NEO CF/MD/HD 3in1 USB reader [US$39.00]
NEO2-TF Flash Cart [US$69.00]
NEO2-SD Flash Cart [US$69.00]
NEO2 Lite 1024M Flash Cart [US$89.00]
NEO2 Lite 512M Flash Cart [US$79.00]
NEO 512M + MK4-mini bundle pack [US$79.00]
NEO MK4-mini for nds & nds lite [US$49.00]
XBOX360 Mini 4GB harddisk [US$99.00]
Super SNK AC adaptor [US$39.00]
Neo 4in1 Mini PSP convertor [US$89.00]
MK3 2006 512M+1G  [US$99.00]
NEO Super SNK MVS convertor  [US$299.00]
Neo PC-Engin  64M Flash [US$109.00]
Neo mini 2in1 convertor [US$79.00]
NEO 8in1 PSP pad (support SD/MMC/CF/MicroDrive) [US$99.00]
Neo-Max 1G for GBA/SP/NDS/GBM  [US$149.00]
MagicKey3 256M+64M     [US$69.00]
Magic Key 2     [US$39.00]
NEO FLash cart 512M     [US$69.00]


The No.4 ~ No.10 : MK5-8G one set OR NEO2 one set OR Neo-PSP 8in1 Joypad one set OR SNK Convertor one set (winner can choose)

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/md/NEO-MD-packing1.JPG)

4   PUNANI v1.0                            By: hallo007
5   metronomPSP                            By: saulotmalo
6   COW TIPS                               By: Sektor
7   Sheep Machine                          By: miNi
4   Pokemon Keeper                        By: N64Francois
5   Space Escape                          By: Grimfate126
6   Call of Duty 2 - PSP Edition v1.0     By: sg57
7   Bumper Car Mayhem                     By: Fuzzie 360
8   Pro Foosball V0.1                     By: Madcupid
9   Legacy                                By: psp_jono
10            Zlink                               By: rattmuffen
4   IRCDS 0.3d                             By: freemaan
5   DSPad                                  By: ced
5   μLibrary                               By: Brunni
6   DSPhoto 1.0                            By: Arialia
7   Pictoblog                              By: 0xtob
8   MapViewerDS                            By: mollusk
9   Binary Clock                           By: mastertop101
4   War of the Weeds                      By: mollusk
5   Duke3DS                               By: GPF
6   Blubb 3D                              By: qwrty
7   BANJO ADVANCE V2 : Kazooie Rescue     By: omg
7   Touchdown! The Alien Attack           By: Sweater Fish Deluxe
8   Earth Invaders 0                      By: smealum
9   SensitiveDS                           By: spinal
10   NDS SPORTS                          By: Davgav

they can choose:
NEO MD flash cart lite version  [US$49.00]
MK5 8G GIGA cart  [US$49.00]
NEO3-Mini-SD NDS Cart for NDS & Lite  [US$49.00]
NEO3-TF NDS Cart for nds-lite only [US$49.00]
NEO3-SD NDS Cart for nds & lite [US$49.00]
NEO CF/MD/HD 3in1 USB reader [US$39.00]
NEO2-TF Flash Cart [US$69.00]
NEO2-SD Flash Cart [US$69.00]
NEO2 Lite 512M Flash Cart [US$79.00]
NEO MK4-mini for nds & nds lite [US$49.00]
Super SNK AC adaptor [US$39.00]
Neo 4in1 Mini PSP convertor [US$89.00]
NEO Super SNK MVS convertor  [US$299.00]
Neo PC-Engin  64M Flash [US$109.00]
Neo mini 2in1 convertor [US$79.00]
NEO 8in1 PSP pad (support SD/MMC/CF/MicroDrive) [US$99.00]
MagicKey3 256M+64M     [US$69.00]
Magic Key 2     [US$39.00]
NEO FLash cart 512M     [US$69.00]    


Click here to submit your address follow our format,we will send the prize from April.10th , and if don't follow our format or submit in time,the winner will lose his(her) prize forever.
http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,4084.0.html
   
   
   
April.6 2007 / NEOFLASH.com

   
Congrats all the winners, and see you at NEO Summer Compo 2007 (Aug.20th 2007) again!   
   
one news about the MK6-motion:
we have decide to allow ALL winner can choose the MK6-motion as the prize  from now, if you have choose your prize already, don't worry, you can choose the MK6-motion and cancel the previous prize,just PM me again and post your final decision here one more time.

(http://www.neoflash.com/img/MK6-Motion-label-mix-out.jpg)

Because from next NEO compo (Aug.20th 2007) we will give more support to the MK6 application,every enter which use the MK6 feature will get +1 score when calculate the final score for winner.   :)
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Brunni on April 06, 2007, 03:54:32 PM
I hope judges didn't believe I was the author of OldSchool Library Sprites Lib. I am the author of the original OldSchool Library, but not of this.

Congrats to all winners (and even who didn't win a prize), great job ;)
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: omg on April 06, 2007, 04:03:46 PM
I hope judges didn't believe I was the author of OldSchool Library Sprites Lib. I am the author of the original OldSchool Library, but not of this.
I think they know.

Thanks all & Congratulation!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: smealum on April 06, 2007, 05:32:48 PM
Very cool !  :)

But, seriously, Beup first AGAIN ?! That's disgusting, he barely changed his app... ::sm-16.gif::
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 06, 2007, 05:37:02 PM
Thanx for all votes/comments and also congrats to everyone who sened his/her game/app to this compo.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: omg on April 06, 2007, 06:36:23 PM
Thanx for all votes/comments and also congrats to everyone who sened his/her game/app to this compo.
I voted for your game  ;D
You've a big crew to make it game! Good job! Congratulation!
When will we have a new version with a market, quests and others ennemies as Diablo or Baldur's Gate?
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Brunni on April 06, 2007, 07:19:03 PM
Very cool !  :)

But, seriously, Beup first AGAIN ?! That's disgusting, he barely changed his app... ::sm-16.gif::

Yeah...
Anyway, there have been a lot of very good entries in this competition, good job :D
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: mastertop101 on April 06, 2007, 09:02:49 PM
Oh damn... I see DCemu judge has been VERY generous with NDSsports..
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: MrShlee on April 07, 2007, 08:50:33 AM
Fantastic releases by everyone but

BEUP SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO BE INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION COMPO AGAIN.. It is not even HtheBs application.. he has updated and released someone elses source!

Plus the fact that Phidias is a much better and completely ORIGINAL application.

Please reconsider this..
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: davr on April 07, 2007, 09:01:32 AM
Wow, someone won the compo by using someone else's code? That doesn't seem fair to me...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: mastertop101 on April 07, 2007, 09:27:44 AM
I 100% agree with you MrShlee, Phidias should win and Dr neo said it
"a whole new version will be allow."

http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,3780.msg26770.html#msg26770
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: lobo on April 07, 2007, 09:42:11 AM
Uh-Oh..that sounds bad, maybe 'Beup author' can explain...

Anyhoo..Phidias should've won..it was leading for a long time, then suddenly-BAM-...second place. Good work anyway Tassu, to me Phidias was a winner since day one.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on April 07, 2007, 12:10:20 PM
Fantastic releases by everyone but

BEUP SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO BE INCLUDED IN THE APPLICATION COMPO AGAIN.. It is not even HtheBs application.. he has updated and released someone elses source!

Plus the fact that Phidias is a much better and completely ORIGINAL application.

Please reconsider this..

oh,really? can you show me more link or something to prove it?
if so,i will do something... ???
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on April 07, 2007, 12:21:07 PM
and here you can give out your vote about the "same project": http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,4090.0.html
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: MrShlee on April 07, 2007, 12:35:25 PM
Beup was originally created by kevinc - http://forum.gbadev.org/viewtopic.php?t=9577

who entered the application in the Summer Compo 2006 -  http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php?topic=3136.0
and won first place in the NDS applications compo!


Anything else? http://forum.gbadev.org/viewtopic.php?t=11485&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=beup&start=750
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on April 07, 2007, 02:48:59 PM
i think HtheB have to say something for this case?
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Timo710 on April 07, 2007, 07:05:18 PM
You guys have gotten it all wrong.  ::sm-10.gif:: Microsoft Changes the MSN protocol a lot of times >:D, everytime that happens, a lot of Beup users (I think more than 1000 users) will not be able to use the Beup messenger O0O.

Until now, HtheB has always been there to help making beup compatible again :P, and that is what I call service ::sm-19.gif::, first of all, HtheB has spend a long time without having a NDS 8), even in this period, he fixed Beup when it was needed. He added some great stuff to it. ::sm-12.gif::

(Damn I love those pinguin emoticons :D)
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: thoduv on April 07, 2007, 07:14:05 PM
I completely agree with you: the first place for Beup is not fair, seeing the *improvements* since last compo.
But anyway, I think it's now too late: if you wanted to complain about this entry, you had to do it before...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: d4rkb1t on April 07, 2007, 09:05:46 PM
I have to say one thing:

HtheB must win the compo for many reasons.

Ok, the project named Beup is a KevinC project, and in any release of BEUP LIVE (it isn't the same project that BEUP, it have the same basic code but it isn't BEUP, it is BEUP LIVE) ,that HtheB post, he put in the credits the name of KevinC, and if you don't believe me please visit the BEUP LIVE webpage's project, and you will see at the bottom of the webpage: HtheB & kevinC.
 
By the way, I have been talking with HtheB and he said me that kevinC let him to do a project with his basic code. So... what am i trying to say with this?

Beup Live is other project diferent than BEUP, with other diferent coder ( HtheB ). So if people have wanted to vote this project and the judges have voted him, it has been for one reason, because beup is really a good project.

By the way... if Beup is discreditted there are more projects that has to be discreditted.

Here we are to vote and comment for the coders and his projects and vote for they.

So for this reasons, Beup Live is the winner for me (and for many people)
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: HtheB on April 07, 2007, 09:13:14 PM
First of all:
I talked to Dr. Neo about posting Beup (with the upgrade) and he accepted my entry

Second:
The results are allready announced...

Third:
kevinC stopped with Beup, so I took over the project. (long time ago now)

Fourth:
There were judges who also give me points.. so there is nothing to do anymore about it..

Fifth:
Why is people coming SOOO late..
You should complain just after I entered the compo!  :(
and not AFTER...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: smealum on April 07, 2007, 10:34:14 PM
We actually started complaining before, but we didn't want to spoil your post... Phidias should have won imo...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: lupidan on April 07, 2007, 11:14:43 PM
The poll has been made, the registrations had been made. If you wanted to complain about his app entering this compo you should have done before, when he entered the project.

But what did people do?, you just let it enter, and now that he has won the first prize you are saying that's not fair. Well I think the thing that is not fair is that attitude you are having with HtheB

By the way, Phidias is a GREAT app, seriously, but I use Beup most, that's why I voted him.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Slasher on April 07, 2007, 11:24:59 PM
It's a shame more PSP applications weren't entered.
AFKIM AND Old school library came 1st and 2nd last year in the 2006 spring competition. And would you look at that - barely updated, and they're 1st and 2nd again winning full out prizes.
There should be a restriction on re-entered programs.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: thoduv on April 08, 2007, 12:54:51 AM
Wait wait: look more closely: OSlib didn't enter.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Slasher on April 08, 2007, 01:05:23 AM
It's virtually the same thing in my books.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: ced on April 08, 2007, 03:26:58 AM
It's virtually the same thing in my books.

It is absolutly not the same thing!

OSlib is a Brunni's project.
Phosphorours created a "sprite handling lib" using oslib functions...

Do i have to retire my project because i used some libc/palib functions?  >:(
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: ETk on April 08, 2007, 04:34:57 AM
I think it's too late now to matter about the results now,  they are already posted.. it won't be fair! .. I've never seen any competition that changes their results after they publish it  >:(

then what I think is that if you guys are complaining about beup position, it's too late now.. why didn't you said something/deny his application when htheb posted it? ... I see some envy people now... it's too late to make changes now!  ::sm-16.gif::
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: GizmoTheGreen on April 08, 2007, 05:36:06 AM
i love these pinguins :D
but thats not why i post...
I've been following Beup since KevinC had it, i made Swedish translation and stuff, the keyboard didnt work though, no support for unicode in it..

HtheB has done much more than just adding DLDI or changed server IP...
He turned Beup into Beup Live!
have you seen the original Beup 0.3 Final?
try that against Beup Live! 0.3d and compare, see any differences?
you'd be blind if you didnt, but its not like KevinC did some easy, "change theese .bmps and the look will change" thing.. no, HtheB recoded alot of stuff, atleast i belive so, or else he himself wouldnt even consider submitting it to the compo, I voted for Beup, and my Vote still stands, changing results afterwards becouse of some b*tching from ppl is not cool, not cool at all...
and I will prolly enter future comps here at Neoflash, but if i use PAlib, will i get kicked out?

I hope not....
Please give HtheB 1st prise, or you'll loose one future contestant  >:(
me...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Arialia on April 08, 2007, 06:47:45 AM
After read all arguments and compare to the last compo, i must say that is normal than Beup live participe to compo (not really same programmer , and a lot of changes but internal)

And for this compo it is too late . stop please with that.

But i think than a new program must have a little advantage in comparaison to olders ... Only judges can do that, not votes.


great works again HtheB and Tassu

Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Sweater Fish Deluxe on April 08, 2007, 08:40:27 AM
My opinion is that Tassu should have won the DS Apps division (he released the best game of the 2006 Summer competition and got second place there and now he releases the best app of the 2007 Spring competition and gets second place again! :'(), however it would not be right to change the results after they have been announced.

I didn't follow the development of BeUP, so I didn't know all this business about HtheB and kevinC, but I really think these comments should have been made earlier if they were important.  I'm not sure they're important anyway.  Development of a program often changes hands, there's nothing wrong with that.  If HtheB's changes to BeUP were enough to make it a valid entry, then he deserves the credit for his work.

The question is should the same game or app be allowed to get 1st place twice in a row.  I think the answer to that is "no." But like I said, I also think it's too late to change the results this time.

Just so long as BeUP doesn't also win the 2007 Summer competition! ???


...word is bondage...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: d-loader on April 09, 2007, 03:29:43 AM
If HtheB's changes to BeUP were enough to make it a valid entry, then he deserves the credit for his work.

That is a good point. The app qualified as an entry. If its true, that dr. neo said go for it, then HtheB should be given the prize. If its really fair or not, is something HtheB and KevinC should work out together, thats none of the voters buisness IMO
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 09, 2007, 10:32:24 PM
Quote
I voted for your game  Grin
You've a big crew to make it game! Good job! Congratulation!
When will we have a new version with a market, quests and others ennemies as Diablo or Baldur's Gate?

Well I will start implementing squirrel (its like Lua) soon. While doing that i am pretty sure some new models will be made. Before i start with quests i wll play with wifi mode and stuff and maybe you will see a Phantasy Star Online like game "soon" :D
Ahh and it should be totally playable just using touchscreen ;) (a bit like zelda ds)
Thanx for voting and for the nice comments.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Tassu on April 10, 2007, 02:17:30 AM
Quote
That is a good point. The app qualified as an entry. If its true, that dr. neo said go for it, then HtheB should be given the prize.

Even if the app qualifies as an entry, I think the judges should give more value to original work that has not won any compo yet. If they would have considered this in their judgement, I don't think Beup would have won. Or should an update be judged the same way as something new? I think not.

Take Beup, remove everything except whats different since last compo and judge what you have left.

Quote
If its really fair or not, is something HtheB and KevinC should work out together, thats none of the voters buisness IMO

It's not so unfair towards KevinC because HtheB has he's permission. It's unfair towars other contestants who most likely all worked harder than HtheB.

But I guess discussing this is pointless now and I don't want to sound like a sore loser. I came second and thats pretty good position :)

[edit] Don't get me wrong. I don't think HtheB did anything wrong. He didn't break any rules so don't be angry at him!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: d-loader on April 10, 2007, 03:56:47 AM
Quote
Take Beup, remove everything except whats different since last compo and judge what you have left.

Thats an interesting point, never thought of that. However, thats what the neo-judges are like, they look at the project as a whole
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: MrShlee on April 10, 2007, 09:42:39 AM
Please give HtheB 1st prise, or you'll loose one future contestant  >:(
me...
you make games with **** hentei fetish porn in them.. big loss :|
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: jester on April 13, 2007, 11:48:18 PM
Make this the last compo that Beup can be entered in RED CARD ::sm-16.gif::

Thats my plan to stop this madness i think that is fair.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on April 14, 2007, 12:28:23 PM
i thought maybe we should hold  HtheB's proze and waiting for KevinC's response, to see what's the KevinC opinion about this case? He have the complete promise to HtheB or not?   ::sm-03::
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: BB on April 14, 2007, 08:20:07 PM
i love these pinguins :D
but thats not why i post...
I've been following Beup since KevinC had it, i made Swedish translation and stuff, the keyboard didnt work though, no support for unicode in it..

HtheB has done much more than just adding DLDI or changed server IP...
He turned Beup into Beup Live!
have you seen the original Beup 0.3 Final?
try that against Beup Live! 0.3d and compare, see any differences?
you'd be blind if you didnt, but its not like KevinC did some easy, "change theese .bmps and the look will change" thing.. no, HtheB recoded alot of stuff, atleast i belive so, or else he himself wouldnt even consider submitting it to the compo, I voted for Beup, and my Vote still stands, changing results afterwards becouse of some b*tching from ppl is not cool, not cool at all...
and I will prolly enter future comps here at Neoflash, but if i use PAlib, will i get kicked out?

I hope not....
Please give HtheB 1st prise, or you'll loose one future contestant  >:(
me...

you're right
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: lobo on April 15, 2007, 03:28:08 AM
i thought maybe we should hold  HtheB's proze and waiting for KevinC's response, to see what's the KevinC opinion about this case? He have the complete promise to HtheB or not?   ::sm-03::

Seems like KevinC is not really around so you might wait quite a long time for that. How about you (neoflash ppl) judge about the case as you are the ones who made the rules in the first place and base your final decision on what you (again) think is right or wrong in this case and..umm..eventually right those wrongs?
So far you've heard both sides in this case, pro and against so make your decision about what you think is right.

And ye..justice is a byatch to serve but someone's gotta do it.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: LiraNuna on April 15, 2007, 05:09:44 PM
Judges made their decision, and final results were posted. NeoFlash accepted the entries and should've "disqualify" them BEFORE making the final results available.

NeoFlash should keep their word and send prizes unless something else is on the subject (like retirement).

Final results are FINAL.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lick on April 16, 2007, 05:35:52 AM
I think the "Final" applies only to the judgment of the software, but it does not mean that if something as important as fraud is discovered, changes can't be made.

A contest is supposed to be entered with one's own work, I don't think there's any need for me to explain why. NeoFlash still keeps their word -- to all other entrants. To the disqualified parties, they might find it unfair, but they did not play fair to begin with.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: LiraNuna on April 16, 2007, 06:03:09 AM
"fraud" !?

HtheB has _contacted_ Dr. Neo before he submitted his entry, with details of what it is. Dr.Neo has ACCEPTED the entry and KNEW about it BEFORE the compo has ended, before the judging were made, and BEFORE the submission was made.

Lick, only one who can comment on this situation is kevinC, if you are his lawyer, do yourself a favor and tell him to speak.

What I see is jealousy, hate and fake drama.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lick on April 16, 2007, 06:11:17 AM
Liranuna: yes, kevinc will be the one who decides this, but if he doesn't respond, an alternative would be comparing the sources.
Also, HtheB lied about the M3Simply review and in this contest did not clearly state to the public that the majority of Beup is coded by KevinC. That's at least deception. Dr Neo might have misplaced his trust. I'm just giving Dr Neo a broader view on this.

About jealousy, I already commented on that in the other topic. I only ruin my own status by trying to point out this matter, I don't get any benefit from this. I don't even have any grudge against HtheB except for this situation. So no, it's not jealousy. I just think the prize should be given to someone who earned it.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 06:22:34 AM
Ok, I really tried to let my fingers from it. Because I never tested Beup 0.2 i really can't tell how much was done by HtheB.

Just some things:
Liran>> Wasn't it you who cried that he was called "dramaqueen" and wanted to leave scene because of that? THEN DON'T ARGUMENT LIKE THEM, YOU AREN'T BETTER!

To the 'final' thing. One year ago I made place 12 or stuff. But they saw the the other Tetris clone was techniqually not better and the votes were faked. So After the Final results it was changed and i got the 6th place. I was totally happy and thankfull about it.

So how could it be bad if Tassu would have same feeling like I had? He would deserve it. Doesn't matter how many changes HtheB made, Tassu coded it all on his own.

So for coding Tassu is the real winner of this compo. Doesn't matter which result is final.
And for making the most usefull app possible, HtheB is the winner.

I didn't said my opinion before because doesn't matter what I would say, I would hurt Tassu or HtheB which are both nice persons. And I still don't want to hurt anyone of them.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: LiraNuna on April 16, 2007, 06:27:02 AM
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THEN DON'T ARGUMENT LIKE THEM, YOU AREN'T BETTER!
I'm trying to stop it now before it gets more serious.

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Wasn't it you who cried that he was called "dramaqueen" and wanted to leave scene because of that?
Payk, don't get me started. You know NOTHING about why I 'left'. Toss that away.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 06:29:13 AM
Sorry for getting mad, but i didn't understood who to say "fake drama" to someone who fights for something what he thinks it the right thing.
I didn't wanted to attack you or stuff. Just was wondering if that statement really was from you...
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Neil on April 16, 2007, 12:44:45 PM
kevinc has surfaced now (http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,4121.msg28582.html#msg28582) and made it clear that HtheB has basically minimal input on the beup client.  Therefore surely the prize should go to the person who actually did all the work?  Either that, or the first prize should be disqualified and it should be sent to the person who finished second.  HtheB should NOT receive it though, and it would be a disgrace if he did.  It would surely just lead to similar source-stealing (and the associated 'drama') in future contests, and I'm sure that's the last thing everyone wants.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 01:44:29 PM
I wouldn't have believed that he did that less. In that case its quite clear in my opinion. PPL like him are the reason why i would take care to release the source. And that's sick in such a scene :(

PS: He still makes great music. Maybe he should focus on that!
But when i would see projects of him, i now would always wonder how much he actually did. Dude, that's an image which you just ****ed up!
HtheB: You told me that you change the entire structure and stuff!
With 15 lines? I am disappointed!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Sektor on April 16, 2007, 04:32:24 PM
Even 15 lines can take hours of work (even one tiny bug can take hours to find).    Many developers spend much longer on their projects but is their app useful to the judges/voters?  I wouldn't vote for an offline drawing app because I don't draw but the author of that did put a lot more effort into it.  I think the problem is that there is no scorecard, judges need specific rules for judging.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: jester on April 16, 2007, 05:08:26 PM
disqualified and left till summer 07 with beup disqualified from ever entering again!

That is correct and Dr.Neo should implement this method to enable the summer contestants to have more prizes as more candidates enter in the summer!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 06:23:00 PM
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Even 15 lines can take hours of work (even one tiny bug can take hours to find).    Many developers spend much longer on their projects but is their app useful to the judges/voters?  I wouldn't vote for an offline drawing app because I don't draw but the author of that did put a lot more effort into it.  I think the problem is that there is no scorecard, judges need specific rules for judging.

Yes they can take hours. But they won't have token that many hours that Phidias needed! My project has about 7283 lines code (because it uses scripts/maps/models/textures. On that way most stuff is outsourced to files and i only have that "few" lines). It tocked me almost one year to make it!
Kevinc made more then 9000 lines. That must have been much work, he actually deserves the Wii more then I do. Phidias should have more then 2000 (I guess! maybe its even much more).

So Phidias should get 2th even if Tassu spend more then 200x effort in it then HtheB? It's a coding competition. He can't win with 15 lines over someone with more then 2000 lines. Even if these 15 lines are totally great.
BTW i know that Tassu is a really great coder and i don't assume HthB's 15 lines beat all lines of Tassus code!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Sektor on April 16, 2007, 07:38:13 PM
It's not just about the amount of effort though.  Someone could make a complex 3D game but the gameplay might be horrible, so it shouldn't win first prize.  I don't know, I spent no effort on my PSP app and I already got my prize, so i'm happy.  If I got 11 place or 2nd place on NDS APPS then I would want Beup disqualified.

A 110v Japanese region Wii wouldn't be much use to someone who didn't have an expensive step down convertor and it will need a region modification to play PAL/US games.  One of the prizes that even 10th place can get, is worth almost as much as the Wii.  I don't think the Japanese Wii includes Wii sports.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 08:40:28 PM
Well, it has nothing to do with which place you are or stuff. I will have my Wii, I ordered a step down converter and I also play Japanese games on my Sega Saturn. I don't care the language for some games. (I prefer shooters where language doesn't matter at all).

And of course effort is the issue. You can't really tell me that you would let somebody win a CODING COMPO who just tocked a source, updated server stuff and made a new skin. Can you actually read?
Try reading that one: "NEO Coding Competitions". Its the thread where you can find this topic! Let me explain the combination of this 3 complex words.
Neo is a short cut for Neoflash.
Coding means to create data which can be read from a machine (for example nds)
Compo is a short cut for competition.

Ok if you bring the last two words together, what do we have there?
Yes! A competition where the main aim is to create codes which runs on machines in order to do (great) stuff. So if you take a code, for example for an instant messenger, change 15 lines and send it in here without any credits, you are a faker rather then a coder. But wasn't it called coding compo instead of faking compo? Well of course he didn't broke a rule. But he also didn't made the app. If you buy alcohol free beer there is still a bit alcohol left. Afaik you can call a beer alcohol free if it has less then 0.5% alcohol. (I am working on a shop which sells international beer...trust me ;P)
Same for this code if you ask me. If HtheB made less then 0.5% of the code, you can call it "HtheB-Free Code".
15 lines of 9200=~0.163%
And I do call it HtheB-free code. HtheB is not the author of this great application, he didn't coded it, that's why he shouldn't make 1th place on a coding compo. That's how I see that. And these are arguments.
That you need a step down converter and just can play Japanese games, and that the Wii might not be that much fun for Halit, is not an argument to let him win.

Earlier i said that i don't want to hurt him because he is a nice person. But he told me he made a completely new structure and fixed many bugs. He lied. He tried that i post here that he should win by telling me storeys of a hard work he made. So for now on i don't care how he fells about it, because he didn't cared how Tassu and all the others fell about it. He also didn't cared if he lies to his friends, and he didn't cared that he would take the Wii by faking to be the coder of Beup!
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Sektor on April 16, 2007, 09:23:39 PM
I understand how you feel, especially since you voted for Beup.  I voted for Pictoblog since I like 0xtob's other applications and it was an original app.  I knew HtheB didn't add much to Beup but I thought he had permission to enter from Kevinc or that he wouldn't mind.  I don't know what HtheB said to you, perhaps a misunderstanding, a slight exaggeration or maybe total lie.

I don't know why I am offering a defense, maybe because I ported and modified other peoples apps, so I know that even small changes can still take lots of my time, especially since I rarely know what i'm doing.  I would feel bad if I saw that I won a Wii and then it was taken away but it seems the judges and voters didn't have all the information and now that they do, it doesn't deserve first place.  I would feel even worse if I spent a lot of time and got 11th place because of Beup.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Payk on April 16, 2007, 09:57:41 PM
Of course it feels bad.
And yeah porting isn't easy. I for my self have heavy problems understanding sources from other ppl and i really think porting is a serious thing.
I really like what GPF does for example. His KOSFS port helped me much.
But its a totally different story how he does that. He always labels it as port. You can't oversee it. He writes it at his page, he writes it in his source, and he wrote it when entering this compo. And last but not least, if he picks up a opensource project, it stays opensource. I never saw a source of beup 0.3.
But there are licenses which everyone has to take care of. And even more he respects the origin of the source. He is a great sample how a porter should behave, and if such a person wins with such a port like duke3ds (which is  MUCH MORE effort  then picking up a source which already exist for this platform and "modify" it) wins i wouldn't be able to say anything against that.

And yeah, that i voted for him is what makes me mad. He didn't stated that ~0.163% of beup is his code and that he made a new skin. I would have preferred binary clock over his project(which is an funny app :D), if I would have knew that. But i guess i would have voted for Phidias.

A port is nothing bad. I really respect porters. Many games were written for a specific machine and its often hard to change settings in order to get it working fine. I wouldn't even know where to start when picking up such a huge code as duke3d. I really would feel lost in that code. Its nothing i could do in a prober way.

But HtheB didn't even ported something. He slighty moded a code (very slight..~0.163%) and changed skin. The funny thing is on his page you should take a look at the credits. He names his self first and Kevinc last.
That's really respectless. Well enough of throwing dirt at him. He maybe already feels embarrassed.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lynx on May 19, 2007, 05:05:23 AM
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if something as important as fraud is discovered, changes can't be made

If by fraud, you mean using someone elses code with permission, then they are all fraud for using libNDS, which  is someone elses code.

If anyone is at fault, it's Neo, they accepted the entry, and that is final.

Do I agree it should have won, not really, it's getting tiring seeing the same old entries.. over.. and over.. and over..  but, if it's accepted, it's accepted.  If Hthe b is the active maintainer of the project, then it is his project.

Should everyone split their prizes with Joat and Dovoto for libNDS?  What about WinterMute for using his toolchain?
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: mastertop101 on May 19, 2007, 05:41:08 AM
Quote
If by fraud, you mean using someone elses code with permission, then they are all fraud for using libNDS, which  is someone elses code.

That must be among the stupidiest thing I've ever seen.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lynx on May 19, 2007, 06:05:52 AM
I agree.. this whole conversation is stupid..
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: mastertop101 on May 19, 2007, 07:07:36 AM
Maybe, but probably less than you :)
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lick on May 19, 2007, 02:07:29 PM
Lynx, I don't think you're stupid but I think you are:

1) Confusing GPL licensed code with zlib licensed code. HthB still hasn't released his modifications which he must.

2) Confusing programming libraries with end-user software. If you think about it more deeply, you'll notice that those have very different purposes.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lynx on May 21, 2007, 10:35:13 PM
I don't see how either of those have anything to do with this topic.

Fraud was claimed because someone used someone elses code.  That is totally different then stating licensing.  Someone elses code, is someone elses code.  If he was using it WITH PERMISSION, it is EXACTLY the same as using ANYONE ELSES code with permission (AKA, A lib, an example, etc)

The point is, HtheB discussed his entry with the judges prior to it being accepted.  They obviously agreed it was worthy of an entry and that is the bottom line.  They also obviously thought it was worhty of winning it's category (though, again, I don't agree with that decision).

mastertop101, I'll let you know when I care about your opinion.. but don't hold your breath.

So, unless one of the following are true, everyone else needs to chill out!

1) You are a judge for this contest
2) You provided funding for the prizes
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Lick on May 22, 2007, 01:21:44 AM
Quote
The point is, HtheB discussed his entry with the judges prior to it being accepted.  They obviously agreed it was worthy of an entry and that is the bottom line.

I seriously doubt that it was made clear that he added relatively little to a project as big as Beup.
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: GizmoTheGreen on May 22, 2007, 04:46:25 AM
though it has been revealed he did add more than 15 lines! alot more, so dont say "relatively little" he did improve alot, its not noticebla on screen, as linkofhyrule or what his name was said, there was even an entirely new section to a relatively small function.

though im not saying your not right he wasnt supposed to win, i still think the fault is at neoteam, and that its bad style fro them to change their minds.

now ive said what i think, and i hope i wont have to post anything more in this thread, as they say: arguing on the internet is doing the special olympics, even if you win, youre still retarded (no offense to "retarded" ppl, i have nothing against them
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Crowleyman on May 31, 2007, 10:07:44 PM
Seriously.. do you ppl complain as much when someone wins in betting also.. OMG he put money on the same team again..? Judges let the app into the compo.. We/they voted (with lots of time to complain) .. someone won.. end of story.. i thought coding was about making cool stuff games/apps for cool machines... not about who get a Wii or not...

If you dont like it.. leave it.. it is not like anyone will get a free Wii cuz they "brought this to attention".
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: ai3gtmc on June 15, 2007, 05:14:27 AM
Seriously.. do you ppl complain as much when someone wins in betting also.. OMG he put money on the same team again..? Judges let the app into the compo.. We/they voted (with lots of time to complain) .. someone won.. end of story.. i thought coding was about making cool stuff games/apps for cool machines... not about who get a Wii or not...

If you dont like it.. leave it.. it is not like anyone will get a free Wii cuz they "brought this to attention".

you don't get it dude... it isn't about the wii ::sm-13.gif::
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: HtheB on June 15, 2007, 04:34:27 PM
No one has got the Wii..

Neither Tassu, neither me..
I talked to the Neo flash guys.. (long time ago)  and told them about that I wanted to send the Wii to him (directly)... they didn't accept my gift for him..
(Tassu can confirm this :) )

This is very weird..

Maybe Neoflash didn't want to spend extra money for a Wii? (or one of the employees wanted to keep it for him/her self?)


 :( :( :( :(


Neoflash...  ::sm-16.gif:: ::sm-16.gif::
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: Dr.neo on June 15, 2007, 05:05:10 PM
http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,4203.0.html
Title: Re: the final result of NEO Spring Compo 2007!
Post by: HtheB on June 15, 2007, 05:27:52 PM
http://www.neoflash.com/forum/index.php/topic,4203.0.html

EXACTLY! :) 3 first prizes.. and not 4 ;)

to save money ;)...  :(